1fish2fish Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 ok, so i'll try to explain all the details as best as i can..... My Tank: 220 gallon Fish and live rock only (maybe) a 30-40gl sump alpha 200 skimmer a lil bit of live sand in the first chamber (after filter sock) I have been having high Nitrates for around 6 months now, around 40-80 ppm. I have done multiple large water changes no less than 6, of at least 60 gallons each....in that 6 month period) Around mid Feb, I was having a pretty bad aiptasia outbreak, so I since I had over 300lbs of LR, i opted to "boil" off the aiptasia. So I put all the rock into a large rubbermaid tub, with some water heaters that heat to 140 and left it in there for at least a week. So i'm fairly sure i killed off all the aiptasia (along with anything else that was growing in there). And before you say what I know you're thinking.....I was already having the high nitrate problem, before the rock boiling.....lol I decided at that time to change my substrate from gravel to Live sand, so I completely emptied my tank (saving around 100gls of the water) cleaned the tank really well of all gravel and everything else....added the sand, and the saved water, then added new water to fill the tank......Oh, I also completely drained and cleaned my sump. After the week of rock boiling, I added it back into the tank, with mostly new water......I should also mention, that I make mix my own water. I use a 4 chamber RO/DI system (that my be time for new filters) I'm planning on getting those next week....I use Instant Ocean salt mix, I mix to .023-.025 salinity. At the time, I only had 5 fish.... Porcupine Puffer Stars & Stripes Puffer Yellow Tang Maroon Clown Eel (I forget what kind) Once everything was back up and running, I was expecting the Nitrates to be pretty low, or at least lower than they were before (again between 40-80 ppm) the difference is depending on the brand of stick I use....I have also done a chemical drip kit test (same results). But they have remained high with no change. Last week, I added a Nitrate removing sponge and used a product called "Dr Tims Waste-Away", that made my take all cloudy for 2 -3 days. I also used a product called "Cobalt aquatics Total Nitrate", that you put into a filter sock and place in my sump along with the Nitrate sponge. It's now been 5 days, and when I tested the water today it still read 80 ppm, then took a sample to the LFS and it read 40 ppm, with their strips. Both of the really knowledgeable fish guys at the LFS (Uncle Bills on West 38th) while very helpful, were both stumped. So now, I turn to you guys....please, all thought and/or theories are welcome.... Thank You all in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryansweet Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 Hate to play devil's advocate here, but there are a few things that could be happening. First off, if you had established live rock and then cooked it, you are going to have nitrite/nitrate issues no matter how much water you changed recently. The beneficial bacteria needs to get into an equal state with the dissolved organics, which there is going to be a lot of after 300lbs of live rock die off. Also, have a fish only tank will almost always have higher nitrates (almost) and doesn't need to be watched as closely. Those puffers, and that eel are going to be dirty fish as far as nitrates go. They eat a lot so they create a lot of waste as well. I'd suggest backing off on feeding (don't starve the fish by any means) and keep up on water changes. It's not easy to bring your nitrates down, and it won't happen overnight, but long term you should be able to keep a tank that size , with that stock load, in the 10-20ppm for nitrates. If you don't plan for coral then I wouldn't worry that much about it, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1fish2fish Posted June 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2018 thanks Ryan, the only problem with your theory is, I was having the high Nitrate problem even before I boiled the rock....and I have always only fed every other day.....also I forgot to mention, the eel has been gone now for about a month and a half, and the Tang died maybe 3 weeks ago...so there are only 3 fish in the whole 200...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryansweet Posted June 26, 2018 Report Share Posted June 26, 2018 What I'm saying is that if you had high nitrates, then did water changes to bring it down, then cooked the rock and put it back in, that's why your nitrates are still high. Any organics you took out with the water changes were added right back when you put the rock with decaying matter back in the tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1fish2fish Posted June 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 20 hours ago, ryansweet said: What I'm saying is that if you had high nitrates, then did water changes to bring it down, then cooked the rock and put it back in, that's why your nitrates are still high. Any organics you took out with the water changes were added right back when you put the rock with decaying matter back in the tank. gotcha....so this is just a "time" thing....I just have to keep doing water changes and wait for the LR to "regrow" (so to speak) to level out the cycle??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetesFolly Posted June 29, 2018 Report Share Posted June 29, 2018 I agree with Ryan. With you LR being boiled, it is going to take awhile for the LR to be effective again and you may still have decaying material left on the rock that can contribute to your nitrates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryansweet Posted June 29, 2018 Report Share Posted June 29, 2018 My troubleshooting for high nitrates is to look at a few different thing. First off, what kind of tank I'm working with (ie. fish only, mixed reef, full sps, qt) and realize what an acceptable level is. Then look at what is contributing to the nitrate levels, water source (self made RODI, store bought RODI, just RO, tap, etc), feeding (how often and how much), type of inhabitants in the tank (smaller fish eat less and make less waste, larger fish = more, predator fish = even more), and die off/decay in the tank. Then look at tank size vs water volume (size of sump/refugium), bigger tank needs bigger sump. Then I look at mechanical/manual removal (protein skimmer - size compared to tank, denitrators, water changes - size and frequency). Without knowing the full history of the tank, it's pretty difficult to narrow down to a specific thing(s). I would guess that with your tank being a fish only/w live rock, and having predators, and having a smaller sump (for the tank size = less water volume) is what is contributing to higher nitrates. Puffers, though one of the coolest fish in the hobby (in my opinion), can be very dirty fish to care for. They are sloppy eaters and create a lot of waste. Even in 220gal tank, 2 puffers can create a lot of dissolved organics. After having high nitrates, then cooking the rocks, I'd imagine it will take 15-20% water changes every couple of weeks, for a few months to get nitrates down and allow good bacteria to get reestablished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1fish2fish Posted July 2, 2018 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 On 6/29/2018 at 9:05 AM, ryansweet said: My troubleshooting for high nitrates is to look at a few different thing. First off, what kind of tank I'm working with (ie. fish only, mixed reef, full sps, qt) and realize what an acceptable level is. Then look at what is contributing to the nitrate levels, water source (self made RODI, store bought RODI, just RO, tap, etc), feeding (how often and how much), type of inhabitants in the tank (smaller fish eat less and make less waste, larger fish = more, predator fish = even more), and die off/decay in the tank. Then look at tank size vs water volume (size of sump/refugium), bigger tank needs bigger sump. Then I look at mechanical/manual removal (protein skimmer - size compared to tank, denitrators, water changes - size and frequency). Without knowing the full history of the tank, it's pretty difficult to narrow down to a specific thing(s). I would guess that with your tank being a fish only/w live rock, and having predators, and having a smaller sump (for the tank size = less water volume) is what is contributing to higher nitrates. Puffers, though one of the coolest fish in the hobby (in my opinion), can be very dirty fish to care for. They are sloppy eaters and create a lot of waste. Even in 220gal tank, 2 puffers can create a lot of dissolved organics. After having high nitrates, then cooking the rocks, I'd imagine it will take 15-20% water changes every couple of weeks, for a few months to get nitrates down and allow good bacteria to get reestablished. thanks Ryan, I really appreciate your input.....i'll continue doing water changes and see what happens in the coming months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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